mulfkfq
qF ik snd rhy
(rfijMdr rfhI df kuLPLr: suirMdr DMjl nflL mulfkfq)
sqvMq dIpk
 

(rfijMdr rfhI dI ikqfb ‘ijwQy pfsL rihMdf hY’ 2008 ivwc pRkfisLq hoeI. ies ikqfb ivwc kRFqIkfrI kvI pfsL aqy pMjfb dI KwbI lihr nflL sMbMiDq ikMnIaF hI nfmvr jwQybMdIaF aqy ivakqIaF ’qy bybuinafd hmly kIqy gey hn. pfsL, pfsL XfdgfrI kOmFqrI tRst, aqy pls mMc nUM muwK insLfnyN bxfieaf igaf hY. anykF nfmvr sLKLsIaqF (Bfa jI gursLrn isMG, jgjIq isMG anMd, sMqoK isMG DIr, guridafl isMG nfvilst, kfmryz hridafl isMG pUnI, kfmryz amolk, suirMdr DMjl) dI dfVHI nOlLI geI hY. pfsL dy ‘sYNsr hox vflLy KLq df duKFq’ kivqf ivwc afKx vFg swc ‘jhflq dI qlLI ’qy ies kdr qViPaf hY ik arQF dy anrQ ho gey hn.’ ieh ilKq sfihqk bd-idafnqdfrI dy nflL nflL rfjnIqk mOkfpRsqI aqy JUT-qUPLfn df koJf ieiqhfsk nmUnf hY jo pMjfbI sfihq nUM klMk bx ky icMbV igaf hY.

mYN mihsUs kIqf ik ies ikqfb ivwc sLfml do aihm sLKLsF - iewk PLrjLI pfqr bfeI gurbIr isMG aqy iewk aslI pfqr suirMdr DMjl - bfry jo kuJ iliKaf igaf hY, lokF ivwc bhuq crcf df ivsLf bixaF hoieaf hY. gurbIr isMG, ijs vwloN DMjl bfry gLYrijLMmyvfr itwpxIaF aqy bybuinafd jLfqI ieljLfm lfey/lgvfey hn, dy aslI pfqr nUM mYN lMby smyN qoN jfxdf hF. Aus dy sI[ pI[ afeI[ (m[ l[) qoN lY ky nfgIrYzI gruwp, aqy iPr ‘pYgLfm’ gruwp dy muKI (jLPLrnfmf, jYkfrf, pYgLfm) qwk dy sPLr qoN vfikPL hF. mYN qPLqIsL df mn bxf ilaf. Aus asl pfqr aqy sfzy iewk sFJy dosq aqy icMqk nflL gwl-bfq kIqI. sFJy dosq ny dwisaf ik rfhI, asl pfqr aqy sFJf dosq: iqMny iewk rfq iksy jgHf iekwTy rhy. AuQy asl pfqr ny rfhI nflL gwl-bfq krdy smyN pfsL bfry qF afpxf stYNz jLrUr ilaf pr DMjl bfry Aus qrHF df bol-kbol iblkul nhIN Auciraf jo rfhI ny asl pfqr nUM ‘gurbIr’ bxf ky Ausdy mUMh ivwc pfieaf hY.

sFJy dosq qoN ieh hkIkq sux ky mYnUM rfhI dI nYiqk eImfndfrI ’qy sLwk hox lwgf. mYN pwkf ierfdf bxfieaf sI ik suirMdr nflL ieMtrivAU kr ky Aus df pwK jfxnf aiq jLrUrI hY. ies mulfkfq leI eynI dyrI df iewk vwzf kfrn ieh sI/hY ik suirMdr DMjl, ijsdI sLKLsIaq nUM CuitafAux leI rfijMdr rfhI dI izksLnrI ’c sLfied hor koeI koJf sLbd nhIN rih igaf, mfrc 2009 ivwc idl df dOrf pY jfx kr ky kuJ dyr pitafly aqy hux vfips kYnzf ivwc jLyry-ielfj hY, nUM mYN iksy tYnsLn vflI siQqI ivwc nhIN sI pfAuxf cfhuMdf. suirMdr myry inwGy dosqF ivwcoN hY, ijs nUM mYN sfihqk qOr ’qy 1972 (sUrjF dy hmsPLr) qoN, aqy 1980-81 qoN jLfqI aqy prvfrk qOr ’qy jfxdf hF. 1980ivaF ivwc iBMzrFvfly (KLfilsqfnIaF) dI cVHq dy idnF ivwc mYN adfrf ‘vqno dUr’ ivwc Aus nfl aYzItorIal borz ivwc keI vrHy kMm kIqf hY. Aus smyN dy ‘vqnoN dUr’ dy aYzItorIal ies gwl df ijAUNdf-jfgdf sbUq hn ik suirMdr smyq asIN sfiraF ny ilKqI rUp ivwc hkUmqI aqy iPLrkU dihsLqgrdI, dohF dy iKLLlfPL zt ky stYNz ilaf. pfsL tRst ivwc 1988 qoN hux qIk Aus df afgU-rol pRqwK hI hY. pfsL tRst dy ieMglYNz aqy kYmlUps (kYnzf) ivwc suirMdr dI agvfeI ivwc krvfey pRogRfm vI mYN Kud atYNz kIqy hn. myrI smJ muqfibk Auh iewk sMvydnsLIl pRgqIvfdI sLfier hox dy nflL nflL bhuq inwGf aqy koml ihrdy vflf ivakqI hY. 1972 (sUrjF dy hmsPLr) qoN lY ky Aus df hux qwk df sfihqk sPLr Aus dI agFhvDU soc nUM pRxfieaf hox, kihxI aqy krnI dI pusLtI krdy hn.

suirMdr DMjl nflL ieh lMmI mulfkfq 12-14 dsMbr 2009 nUM hoeI, jdoN Auh iksy sfihqk smfgm ivwc sLfml hox leI kYmlUps qoN vYnkUvr afieaf sI (ies mulfkfq nUM kMipAUtr ’qy tfeIp-sYWt krn vfsqy mYN imWqr iekbfl rfmUvflIaf df aqI DMnvfdI hF). ieh mulfkfq sfzy afpsI ivcfr-vtFdry df incoV hY- sqvMq dIpk)

dIpk- gwlbfq ÈurU krn qoN pihlF mYN ieh jLrUr mihsUs krdf hF ik rfijMdr rfhI dI ikqfb ‘ijwQy pfsL rihMdf hY’ ny pMjfbI sfihqk aqy rfjnIqk buwDIjIvIaF ivwc iqwKI crcf jLrUr CyVI hY. sLfied ies df kfrn pfsL pRqI pfTkF dI jigafsf hY. pr sfrI pusqk pVHn AuprMq lyKk dI pfsL vrgy pMjfbI kRFqIkfrI kivqf dy moZI kvI, lyKk, aqy icMqk dI sLKLsIaq bfry gMBIr sLMky KVHy krn aqy pMjfb dI nkslI lihr nUM bdnfm krn dy mnsLy, aqy anykF hI aihm jwQybMdIaF aqy ivakqIaF AuWpr mujrmfnF iksm dI icwkV-AuCflI pVH ky kicafx afAuNdI hY. jykr pfsL ijAUNdf huMdf, qF XkIkn hI aYsI rcnf nUM vIBwqs-rs vflI rcnf hI kihMdf[[[mYN ies lyKk dI nYiqk ijLMmyvfrI qoN kuqfhI dI qih qwk phuMcxf cfhuMdf hF.
 DMjl- afpF gwl rfhI dI nYiqk eImfndfrI qoN hI ÈurU kr lYny aF[[[ pusqk dy bYk-tfeItl ’qy PLoto rfijMdr rfhI dI hY, pr itwpxI zfktr rfijMdrpfl isMG brfV (pMjfbI XUnIvristI) dI hY. ieh itwpxI pfsL dI kivqf aqy sLKLsIaq bfry pRsMsfqmk pRBfv idMdI hY, pr nfvl ivwc pfsL nUM ies dy iblkul AulLt iewk sLrfbI-kbfbI, aqy gLYr-ijLMmyvfr Cokrf iswD kr ky burI qrHF nkfiraf igaf hY. jy nfvl ivwc pfsL nUM eynf durkfrnf hI sI, qF bYk-tfeItl ’qy ies ikqfb dy pfsL-pwKI hox df jfalHI pRBfv ikAuN idwqf igaf? kfrn spsLt hY: pfTkF nUM ies ikqfb vwl iKwcx leI pfsL dI mkbUlIaq dI durvrqoN kIqI geI hY. lyKk dI bd-idafnqdfrI dI ieh pihlI imsfl hY. hor vI anykF imsflF hn. ikMnIaF ku imsflF kfPLI hoxgIaF?

dIpk- ies mulfkfq df mMqv murdy puwtxf nhIN. ies ikqfb dy rIlIjL hox AuprMq anykF hI lyKkF dy lyK, rIivAU, rUbrU, pRiqkrm aqy spsLtIkrn Cp cuwky hn. vwK vwK simaF ’qy pRkfisLq dsqfvyjLF ivwc bKLisLMdr, jsvMq KtkV, prmjIq dyhl, aqy dIp klyr ny ieh spsLt iliKaf hY ik ikqfb ivwc AunHF dy mUMhF ivwc pfeIaF geIaF gwlF mnGVq hn. pwqrkfr jsvIr smr (‘isrjxf’) aqy khfxIkfr aqrjIq (‘srokfr’) dI qPLqIsL anusfr rfhI dIaF anykF hor gwlF mnGVq hn. ajmyr isMG dIaF sfrIaF srgrmIaF bfry kfmryz srdfrf isMG mfihl, aqy kfmryz suKdrsLn nwq dy ivsQfr-pUrbk lyK kRmvfr ‘ienklfbI sfzf rfh’ aqy ‘lok-morcf’ (mfnsf) ivwc Cp cuwky hn. zf: gurbcn (‘iPlhfl’), zf: primMdr isMG (gurU nfnk dyv XUnIvristI/sfihq df sfgr: pfsL), khfxIkfr aqy KojfrQI ajmyr iswDU (‘srokfr’ 37), aqy rMgkrmI sLbdIsL (‘srokfr’ 37) anykF hor qwqF aqy qwQF nUM AuGfV cuwky hn. ies krky iehnF ivisLaF ’qy kuJ hor kihx dI, jF duhrfAux dI jLrUrq nhIN. pr lyKk df ies ikqfb nUM ilKx df koeI mksd qF hovygf, nhIN qF ieMnf joKLm AuTfAux dI Aus nUM kI jLrUrq sI?

DMjl- rfhI dI ilKq df pihlf mksd pfsL dI mkbUlIaq dI durvrqoN krky KLfilsqfn dI lihr nUM glorIPfeI krnf sI. ies lyKk dI smuwcI bd-idafnqdfrI dI qih qwk phuMcx leI kuJ sMbMiDq GtnfvF df ipCokV smJxf jLrUrI hY. sMq rfm AudfsI XfdgfrI tRst (kOmFqrI) dI sQfpnf smyN ies dy skwqr rfijMdr rfhI df Bfrq qoN, aqy pRDfn suKivMdr kMdolLf df XU[ ky[ qoN mhIny ’c keI vfrI PLon afAuNdf huMdf sI. pfsL XfdgfrI kOmFqrI tRst dy knvInr vjoN, 1988 qoN hux qIk, pRgqIsLIl lihr pRqI myrI inrMqr pRqIbwDqf dI, aqy pfsL tRst dIaF Bfrq, XU[ ky[, XU[ aYWs[ ey[, aqy kYnzf dIaF bRFcF nUM iewk-muwT krn vflLI myrI kfrj-sLYlI dI BrpUr sLlfGf kIqI jFdI sI; myry duafrf ilKy gey pfsL XfdgfrI kOmFqrI tRst dy sMivDfn nUM iewk afdrsLk mfzl mMn ky sMq rfm AudfsI tRst df sMivDfn AunHF hI lIhF ’qy Ausfrn leI myrI agvfeI dI mMg kIqI jFdI sI; myry kolLoN iekbfl rfmUvflIaf aqy hor njLdIkI imwqrF nUM AudfsI tRst leI idl-KolH ky mflI mwdd krn leI kihx dI mMg kIqI jFdI sI; pfsL tRst dIaF sfrIaF bRFcF nUM myry vwloN ieh inrdysL dyx dI mMg kIqI jFdI sI ik Auh bRFcF rfijMdr rfhI dy kYnzf aqy XU[ ky[ dy ‘qUPLfnI-dOry’ vfsqy hvfeI-itkt smyq rfhI dy snmfn ivwc sQfnk pwDr ’qy smfgm afXoijq krn df ieMqjLfm krn. AudfsI tRst dy blfcOr smfgm (12 sqMbr 2004) ivwc pMjfbI kRFqIkfrI kivqf dy iewk moZI kvI kfmryz drsLn KtkV nUM aqy mYnUM muwK-mihmfnF vjoN swd ky rfhI ny AudfsI bfry sMpfidq afpxI pusqk ‘sMq rfm AudfsI: sMpUrn kfiv’ (sM[ kf[) rIlIjL krvfeI sI. rIlIË krfAux qoN pihlF qwk sB awCf sI. asl qkrfr ies pusqk qoN ÈurU huMdf hY.

dIpk- Auh ikvyN? mYN ies qkrfr dI qih qwk phuMcxf cfhuMdf hF.

DMjl- rfhI dI ies sMpfidq pusqk dy mwuKbMD ivwc, sMq jrnYl isMG iBMzrFvflLy nUM ‘gurIlf XuwD dI pirBfsLf nUM nvyN arQ pRdfn krn vflLf’ mMinaF igaf sI; pfsL aqy ienklfbI nkslI iDrF nUM nkfiraf igaf sI; aqy sMq rfm AudfsI nUM afpxI ijLMdgI dy afKLrI virHaF ivwc iBMzrFvflLy dy pRBfv hyT af ky, Aus dy Drm-XuwD nUM lok-XuwD vjoN pRvfn krn vflLf iswD kIqf igaf sI. prmjIq dyhl, dIp klyr aqy myry vwloN rfhI nUM Auprokq gLlq-ibafnIaF aqy ieiqhfsk qwQF nUM qoVn-mroVn dIaF koisLsLF df spsLtIkrn dyx leI dysL Bgq hfl jlMDr ivwc AudfsI tRst dI bfkfiedf mIitMg rwK ky, ilKqI swdf-pwqr zfk rfhIN Byj ky, bulfieaf igaf. rfhI afAux df vfadf kr ky vfadf-nsLIN hoo igaf. afpxy nf af skx dI ijMLmyvfrI afpxI pqnI dy isr mVH ky sfPL brI hox dIaF nfkfm koisLsLF krdf irhf. ËubfnI gwl-bfq smyN Aus df rvweIaf ieh huMdf sI ik “mYN AudfsI tRst df skwqr aqy muwK-bulfrf hF, ies kr ky AudfsI jF pfsL bfry jo mrjLI ilKF, myrf koeI kI ivgfV lAU?” blfcOr smfgm qoN bfad mYN qy kfmryz drsLn KtkV jd gLdrI bfibaF dy myly ’qy nvMbr 2004 ivwc jlMDr imlLy qF asIN dovyN sihmq sI ik blfcOr smfgm ivwc rfhI ny sfQoN AudfsI dy ivcfrF nUM qoVn-mroVn vflIaF ikqfbF DoKy nfl rIlIjL krf ky sfnUM dohF nUM buwDU bxfieaf hY.

dIpk- pr mYN qF ieMtrnYWt ’qy piVHaf sI ik rfhI dI skwqrI hyT cwl rhy AudfsI tRst ny dsMbr 2004 ivc sMq rfm AudfsI dy ipMz rfiesr iewk smfgm ivwc kRFqIkfrI kvI drsLn KtkV qoN ielfvf jsivMdr, mihMdrpfl BwTlL, ajIq rfhI, aqy quhfnUM pMjfbI kRFqIkfrI kivqf nUM AuWGy Xogdfn leI snmfinq kIqf sI?

DMjl- iblkuwl drusq hY. 18 dsMbr 2004 nUM rfhI ny sMq rfm AudfsI dy ipMz rfiesr ivwc ijs smfgm df pRbMD kIqf, Ausdf pUrf nfm sI: ‘pihlf sMq rfm AudfsI XfdgfrI sfihqk qy siBafcfrk smfgm’! smfgm qoN kuJ idn pihlF, ies snmfn leI mYnUM Xog smJy jfx dI, aqy smfgm ’c sLfml hox dy swdf-pwqr dI sUcnf dyx leI, rfhI mYnUM lBdf-lBfAuNdf lfielpur KLflsf kflj jlMDr phuMicaf, ijwQy moZI kRFqIkfrI kvI zf[ virafm sMDU ny afpxy ividafrQIaF nflL myry rUbrU df pRbMD kIqf hoieaf sI. jLfhr hY ik ies smyN qwk, rfhI dI ingHf ivwc mYN AuWGf kRFqIkfrI kvI sI, pfsL tRst df sPLl jwQybMdk sI, rfhI dI skwqrI hyT cwl rhy AudfsI tRst dy kYnzf dy mYNbr hox dy Xog sI, aqy ‘pihly AudfsI snmfn’ nflL invfjy jfx df hwkdfr sI[[[

dIpk- ikqfb ivwc suirMdr DMjl nUM “siqkfrq cfcf DMjl ijs dI Ëubfn ’qy sursqI vfs krdI hY”, qoN lY ky aKLIr ivwc ‘pfzf’, ‘Pukrf’, ‘do pIaYWc[ zIaF kr ky ssqI Èuhrq lYx df Xqn krn vflLf ipafsf KUh’, ‘skwz imjLfiel Cwzx df Brm pflx vflLf’, ‘PokI crcf krvfAux leI QF QF rUbrU krvfAux vflLf’ aqy hor pqf nhIN kI kI drsfieaf igaf hY. rfhI dI ies Ault-CVwpf klfbfjLI dI kI vjHf ho skdI hY?

DMjl- rfhI dI AulLt-CVwpf klfbfjLI Auprokq rfiesr smfgm ivwc isKr ’qy phuMc geI . ies smfgm ivwc mYN, rfhI vwloN sMq rfm AudfsI dy kfivk ivcfrF nUM qroV-mroVn dIaF, AudfsI dy Tos mfrksvfdI-lYinnvfdI stYNz nUM iPLrkU jnUMn dy hwk ’c BugqfAux dIaF, AudfsI dy iswK ivrsy dIaF sLfndfr rvfieqF qoN pRBfvq hox dy pRqwK stYNz nUM iBMzrFvflLy dy ‘gurIlf XuwD’ dy hwk ivwc BugqfAux dIaF sfjLsLF dI styj qoN sKLq sLbdF ivwc inKyDI kIqI. myry kuJ ku coxvyN sLbd ieh sn: “nkslvfVI lihr nflL juVy hox krky pMjfb puls dy aMnHy qsLwdd qoN bfad sMq rfm AudfsI hr duibDf nUM iqafg ky pwky qOr ’qy mfrksvfd-lYinnvfd nflL juV igaf sI. AudfsI iswK ivrsy dIaF sLfndfr rvfieqF qoN jLrUr pRBfvq sI, pr Drm dIaF puVIaF ’c lpyty iksy vI iPLrkU jnUMn nflL jF KLfilsqfn nfl AudfsI df kdy vI koeI vfh-vfsqf nhIN sI. rfijMdr rfhI jy afpxy kwlH dy ‘kRFqIkfrI’ (?) stYNz nUM iqlFjlI dy ky awj KLfilsqfn df smrQk bx igaf hY qF ies df Aus nUM pUrf hwk hY. jykr lYinn nUM ‘imwqr ipafrf’ ilKdy ilKdy sMq isMG syKoN ny, aqy ‘lhU dI loa’ rcx vflLy bfeI isEN jsvMq isMG kMvl ny afpxy ivcfr bdl ley hn, qF rfhI nUM vI hwk hY ik Auh vI ienHF vwzy vwzy QMmF vFg afpxy ivcfr bdl ky KLfilsqfn df smrQk hox df aYlfn kr dyvy. pr rfhI jF iksy hor nUM ieh koeI hwk nhIN ik sMq rfm AudfsI nUM CFg ky afpxy myc df krn dI koisLsL kry. sMq rfm AudfsI mfrksvfdI-lYinnvfdI sI; hY, aqy rhygf.”

myry ienHF ivcfrF df drsLkF ny qfVIaF nflL svfgq kIqf. AudfsI dI bytI iekbfl kOr AudfsI (ijs nUM rfhI AudfsI-prvfr ivwcoN sB qoN vwD aqy drusq kRFqIkfrI kihMdf huMdf sI, aqy jo hux pRgqIsLIl iesqrI sBf dI sUbfeI afgU hY), ny AuWT ky ‘sMq rfm AudfsI, amr rhy’ aqy ‘mfrksvfd-lYinnvfd, ijMLdfbfd’ dy nfary gUMjfey. sfzI sFJI smJ anusfr, kfmryz KtkV ny vI myry ivcfrF dI styj qoN pRoVHqf kr idwqI. rfiesr smfgm ivwc snmfinq kIqy gey sfQoN pMjF aqy iekbfl kOr AudfsI qoN ielfvf, pMjfb dy pRgqIvfdI BfeIcfry nflL juVIaF hoeIaF kuJ AuWGIaF sLKLsIaqF (nftkkfr ajmyr aOlK, zf[ qyjvMq mfn, kfmryz suKdrsLn nwq, jgdIp icqrkfr, dIdfr sLyqrf, prmjIq dyhl, mfstr hrBgvfn brnflf), AudfsI dI jIvn-sfQx nsIb kOr AudfsI, ipMz rfiesr dI srpMc bIbI (nfm Xfd nhIN), aqy kfmryz amr isMG awcrvfl dI bytI smyq sYNkVy lok hfjLr sn. jy rfhI swcf sI qF Aus nUM AudoN hI styj qoN gwj vwj ky spsLt krnf cfhIdf sI ik DMjl, rfhI dy jF AudfsI dy ivcfrF nflL byiensfPLI kr irhf hY. ies smfgm ivwc qF rfhI kusikaf nhIN, pr AudfsI df ipMz rfiesr rfhI df shurf ipMz hY aqy rfhI myrI aflocnf nUM kuJ vDyry hI idl ’qy lf igaf. sÍY-aflocnf dy aOKy rfh dI QF Auh myry cirwqr-Gfq dy sOKy rfh df rfhI bx igaf hY. hux sUJvfn pfTk Éud inrxf kr skdy hn ik rfhI nUM rfiesr smfgm qwk ijs “suirMdr DMjl dI suihrdqf pRqI koeI sLwk nhIN” sI (sM[ kf[, sPLf 29), 18 dsMbr 2004 qoN bfad ‘iewkdm’ hI eynf niKWD ikAuN bx igaf!

dIpk- dIp klyr aqy prmjIq dyhl anusfr “AuhnF nMU ijhVy prUPL rfhI ny ipMz hwpovfl (bMgf) ivKy hrBjn isMG dI motr 'qy pVHfey sn, Auh CpI ikqfb nflLoN bhuq vwKry sn. AuhnF ivwc ikqfb df gurbIr isMG aqy KLfilsqfn vflLf ihwsf hY nhIN sI.”

DMjl- iblkuwl drusq hY. ikqfb ‘ijwQy pfsL rihMdf hY’ vI pihlF blfcOr hI rIlIjL hoxI sI, pr lyt ho geI. jLfhr hY ik gurbIr isMG vflLf ihwsf, jo pihlF hY hI nhIN sI, rfiesr smfgm qoN bfad, bdly dI Bfvnf nflL GiVaf igaf hY. ‘ijwQy pfsL rihMdf hY’ jy rfhI dI pihlI XojnfbMdI anusfr blfcOr (12 sqMbr 2004) ivwc rIlIjL ho jFdI, jF mYN rfiesr smfgm (18 dsMbr 2004) dI styj qoN rfhI dI aflocnf nf krdf, qF mYN (rfhI dIaF nvMbr 1996 aqy 2004 ivwc pRkfisLq dohF pusqkF anusfr) ‘srsvqI dy vrdfn’ nfl vrosfieaf, ‘jmfqI aqy jIvn dy bhu psfrI sbMDF nUM afpxI rcnfqimk pRiqBf rfhIN rUpmfn’ krn vflLf, ‘klfqimk puKLqgI hfsl kr’ cuwikaf, ‘lok GolF nfl juiVaf’, ‘iswDy qOr ’qy lokF dy jjLibaF nUM tuMbx’ vflf ‘cfcf suirMdr DMjl’ hoxf sI. so ieh hY rfhI dI bd-idafnqdfrI dI asl khfxI!

dIpk- cMgI qrHF spsLt ho igaf hY ik rfhI ny pfsL, DMjl aqy pfsL tRst dy iKLlfPL muihMm ikAuN ivwZ leI hY! pusqk ivwc ijhnF nfmvr ivakqIaF ’qy hmly kIqy/krvfey gey hn, AunHF sfiraF dy nfm aslI hn, pr ijs ivakqI qoN ieh hmly krvfAux df ZONg rcfieaf igaf hY, Auh iewk nklI nfm ‘bfeI gurbIr isMG’ hY. rfhI vwloN ajyhy nklI pfqr dI isrjxf kr ky afpxf iZwz hOlLf krnf asl ivwc Aus dI sfihqk bdmfsLI sI.

DMjl- rfhI afp, ies ilKq dy sfry rIvIAUkfr, aqy Éud ‘ajmyr isMG’ ieh mMn cuwky hn ik ieh pfqr ‘asl’ ivwc myrf gurU nfnk ieMjnIairMg kflj luiDafxf df hmjmfqI aqy sfbkf nkslvfdI goibMdr isMG (mMzI klF) hY, jo nkslbfVI dOr dy cwkrvrqI jIvn smyN ipMz ‘ZuwzIky’ (mflvf) ivwc suirMdr isMG cuwGf huMdf sI, mfJy ivwc gurmIq isMG huMdf sI, jo KLfilsqfn pwKI pYgLfm-gruwp df afgU huMdf sI, aqy awj-kwlH ‘iswK buwDIjIvI’ ajmyr isMG hY. 1970 julfeI dy aMq jF agsq dy ÈurU ivwc myry AuWpr puls df Cfpf ipaf. puls dI KwjlL KuafrI qoN qMg af ky mYN afpxI vwzI BYx df Gr Cwz ky kflj dy hostl ivwc rihx lwg ipaf sI qF 1971-72 dOrfn cwkrvrqI goibMdr isMG mYnUM kflj dy hostl ivwc sunyhf Byj ky imlLdf huMdf sI. mYnUM imlx dI AuhnUM kI loV sI, Auh vI Aucycf sunyhf Byjky? akqUbr 1972 ivc mYN kYnzf af igaf sI. ijhVf ivakqI mYnUM 1972 qoN bfad kdy imilLaf hI nhIN, AuhnUM ieh ‘ielhfm’ ikvyN ho igaf ik afpxIaF Bfrq-PyrIaF dOrfn, afpxy irsLqydfrF kolL mYN ikvyN ivcrdf hF? so rfhI dI sfihqk bdmfsLI vflLI quhfzI gwl iblkuwl drusq hY.

dIpk- jsvIr smr (‘isrjxf’ 151) anusfr “[[[ ieQoN qwk ik gurbIr isMG, ijs dy afeIzIey dI qrjmfnI leI ieh ikqfb rcI geI, df vI kihxf hY ik Aus vwloN kIqIaF gwlF nMU vI qoV-mroV ky pysL kIqf igaf. Aus muqfbk DMjl bfry kIqIaF awKV gwlF AusdIaF afpxIaF nhIN. Aus (gurbIr) vwloN puwCx 'qy rfhI ny isrP ieMnf hI ikhf ik Aus nMU DMjl AuWqy guwsf bhuq sI[[[.” lgdY rfhI aslI pfqr ajmyr isMG dy moZy ’qy rwK ky clf igaf[[[

DMjl- rfhI aqy ajmyr isMG, dohF ny iewk-dUjy dy moZy ’qy rwK ky clfeI hY. ajmyr isMG ny, pRiswD gIqkfr aqy myry imwqr sLmsLyr sMDU dy dwsx anusfr, sMDU nflL ‘ijwQy pfsL rihMdf hY’ dy Cpx qoN bfad hoeI iewk mulfkfq dOrfn ikhf sI ik “DMjl bhuq ipafrf iensfn hY aqy rfhI ny DMjl dy iKLlfPL sfrIaF gwlF Aus dy mUMh ivwc pfeIaF hn.” pr ikwQy sLmsLyr sMDU aqy jsvIr smr nUM khIaF ieh zubfnI gwlF, ikwQy ilKqI gwlF?

ajmyr isMG nflL myry ivcfrDfrk vKryvyN hn. myry aqy ajmyr isMG dy rfh, Ausdy pYgLfmvfdI bxn qoN bfad, bhuq vwKry ho gey. jy qusIN iekwlI hkUmqI dihsLqgrdI df ivroD krdy ho, qF jfxy-axjfxy qusIN iPLrkU dihsLqgrdI dy hwk ivwc Bugqdy ho. jy qusIN iekwlI iPLrkU dihsLqgrdI df ivroD krdy ho, qF jfxy-axjfxy qusIN hkUmqI dihsLqgrdI dy hwk ivwc Bugqdy ho. shI stYNz ieh hY ik hkUmqI aqy iPLrkU dihsLqgrdI, dohF df ivroD kIqf jfvy. afpxy iehnF ivcfrF nUM, jF pYgLfm-gruwp bfry jo kuJ kihxf sI, ‘vqnoN dUr’ (1973-1986) ivwc, asIN hmysLF afpxy nfm hyT ikhf. ajmyr isMG nUM vI cfhIdf sI ik myry nflL afpxy vKryivaF bfry jo kuJ kihxf sI, afpxy nfm hyT kihMdf; aqy jo kuJ Aus ny nhIN ikhf, Aus df KMzn krdf.

dIpk- ajmyr isMG dI cuwp mYnUM vI rVkdI hY. ajmyr isMG dy pfsL nflL ivcfrDfrk vKryivaF nUM hor spsLt kro.

DMjl- ajmyr isMG dy pfsL nflL ivcfrDfrk vKryvyN pRqwK hn. 1970ivaF ivwc ajmyr isMG vI pfsL vFg hI Drm-afDfirq styt dy sMklp df ivroDI sI. AudoN ajmyr isMG mfrksvfdI–lYinnvfdI prcy ‘kimAUinst vrkr’ ivwc KLfilsqfnIaF dy Drm-afDfirq styt dy sMklp dI zt ky ivroDqf krdf huMdf sI. AudoN Auh eyzf vwzf ‘kOmFqrIvfdI’ sI ik pUry df pUrf sMsfr Aus nUM iewko kOm njLr afAuNdf sI. AudoN Bfrq bfry Auh ilKdf huMdf sI: ‘DrqI df iewk tukVf ijs df nfm Bfrq hY.’ awj, AusdI ivsLfl ‘kOmFqrIvfdI’ soc KLfilsqfn qwk suMgV geI hY. pfsL, mrdy dm qwk afpxy stYNz ’qy zitaf irhf, pr ajmyr isMG bdl igaf hY. ajmyr isMG ny afpxy ies bdly hoey stYNz muqfbk pfsL df hI ivroD nhIN kIqf, Aus ny afpxI pusqk “iks ibD rulI pfqsLfhI” ivwc gLdr pfrtI aqy Bgq isMG qy Auhdy sfQIaF nMU pMjfb-ivroDI aqy iswK-ivroDI sfbq krn df Xqn vI kIqf hY, ikANuik gLdrI aqy Bgq isMG ‘ihMdusqfn’ aqy ‘Bfrq’ dI gwl krn vflLy ‘rfsLtrvfdI’ sn. pfsL dy kql bfry vI ajmyr isMG dy ivcfr bdldy rhy hn. 28 julfeI 1988 nUM ilKy iewk pYNPilt ivwc ajmyr isMG anusfr pfsL df kql “kuJ KLfilsqfnIaF kwtVpMQIaF dy aMnHy jnMUn qy bysmJI ’coN kIqf iek bwjr gunfh” sI. rfhI dI ikqfb df gurbIr isMG (pMnf 123) “KLfilsqfnIaF dy TrMmy dI dfd” dy irhf hY ik “AunHF ny ibafsI qoN aTfsI qwk pfsL[[[ nUM sbr nflL brdfsLq kIqf.”

dIpk- amrjIq cMdn ny pMjfbI itRibAUn cMzIgVH 13 apRYl 2008 ivwc rfhI dI pfsL dy kfqlF (jF KLfilsqfnIaF) dy hwk ivwc Bugqx vflLI ies ikqfb bfry pRsMsfqmk rIivAU iliKaf hY. ijhVf cMdn ‘asIN QuwkFgy iBMzrFvflLf’ ilKdf huMdf sI, ijhVf cMdn ‘koeI afpxy bwcy df nfm jrnYl isMG nhIN rwKygf’ ilKdf huMdf sI, aqy KLfilsqfn df kwtV ivroDI huMdf sI, AuhI cMdn ies muihMm ivwc rfhI df smrQk ikAuN bx igaf hY?

DMjl- kwlH, pfsL df sB qoN vwzf smrQk hox df dfavf krn vflLf, iBMzrFvflLy df kwtV ivroDI, aqy 1960ivaF-70ivaF df pRiswD kRFqIkfrI kvI amrjIq cMdn, awj, rfhI dI pfsL-ivroDI ikqfb bfry pRsMsfqmk rIivAU hI nhIN ilK irhf, blik rIivAU ilKdy smyN hrduafr dIaF vhIaF ’coN pfsL dy vwz-vzyiraF df ‘kfql ipCokV’ ZUMz ky Cfpx df suJfa vI dy irhf hY. pfsL dy iksy vwz-vzyry dy kfql hox df Blf rfhI dI ikqfb nflL jF pfsL dy kRFqIkfrI kivqf nUM smuwcy Xogdfn nflL kI sMbMD juVdf hY? myry nflL cMdn nUM ieh icVH hY ik ‘sMK’ (cMzIgVH) dy 2004 dy aMqly iksy aMk ivwc mYN cMdn dy pfsL bfry aijhy dogly stYNz dI ztvIN ivroDqf kIqI sI.

kwlH, nvMbr 1996 ivwc rfhI dI sMpfidq pusqk ‘sMq rfm AudfsI (jIvn aqy smuwcI rcnf)’ dy sPLf 9 anusfr pfsL dIaF “sLhId hox qoN pihlF ‘sB qoN KLqrnfk’ aqy ‘bydÉlI leI ibnY pwqr’ kivqfvF qF Auc pfey dI klfqimk puKLqgI CUh lYNdIaF hn.” pr awj , 2004 vflLI pusqk ‘sMq rfm AudfsI: sMpUrn kfiv’ dy sPLf 22 anusfr pfsL“23 mfrc 1988 nUM KLfilsqfnIaF hwQoN kql hox qwk guMmnfmI dI grdsL ’c smf igaf sI.” dyKI klfbfjLI? dUjI klfbfjLI: AudfsI dIaF KLfilsqfnI lihr qoN sflF pihlF ilKIaF geIaF iswK ivrsy vflLIaF kivqfvF nUM eysy pusqk dy 40 siPLaF dy muwKbMD ivwc vfr vfr ieAuN pysL krdf hY, ijvyN KLfilsqfnI lihr dOrfn jF KLfilsqfnI lihr dy hwk ’c ilKIaF geIaF hox. rfhI dI aslI aqy vwzI klfbfjLI ieh hY ik Auh iewko smyN ‘kRFqIkfrI’, ‘KLfilsqfnI’, aqy ‘bfbf sfihb aMbyzkr jI df pYrokfr’ hox dy iqMny gurj iekwTy sMBflxy cfhuMdf hY. ieh cuPyr-gVHIey ikrdfr dI isKr hY.

so keI vKryivaF dy bfvjUd ajmyr isMG, rfhI aqy cMdn ’c afpsI sFJ ieh bxdI hY ik awj , ieh iqMny afpxy kwlH dy kRFqIkfrI stYNz qoN kohF dUr iqlk cuwky hn. awj-kwlH iqMnF nUM kRFqIkfrI ivcfrDfrf, pfsL, aqy pfsL dy hr smrQk nflL icVH hY. ies krky iksy nUM koeI hYrfnI nhIN hoxI cfhIdI ik cMdn dI kivqf nUM pfsL dI kivqf vFg ivsLfl mkbUlIaq ikAuN nhIN imlLI, jF rfhI dI pfsL, DMjl aqy pfsL tRst dy iKLlfPL ivwZI ies muihMm ivwc amrjIq cMdn, rfhI df smrQk ikAuN bx igaf hY. aqy nf hI rfhI dI ies muihMm ivwc ajmyr isMG dy iswDy/aiswDy smrQn bfry koeI hYrfnI hoxI cfhIdI hY.

dIpk- pfsL dy nflL nflL AudfsI dy kRFqIkfrI kivqf nUM Xogdfn bfry quhfzy kI ivcfr hn?

DMjl- nkslvfVI lihr dy pRBfv hyT AudY hox vflLI pMjfbI kRFqIkfrI kivqf dy mYN nON moZI kvI mMndf hF: pfÈ, lfl isMG idl, sMq rfm AudfsI, hrBjn hlvfrvI, gurdIp gryvfl, drsLn KtkV, amrjIq cMdn, virafm sMDU, aqy sMq sMDU. iehnF sfiraF dy 1960ivaF-70ivaF dy afgU rol df myry mn ’c byhwd aqy sdIvI siqkfr hY, sB df afpxf afpxf ivlwKx sQfn hY, pr myrI njLr ’c pfÈ iehnF sfiraF ’coN vwzf sLfier hY. AudfsI nUM ‘ikMqU’ dy AudfsI-aMk (akqUbr-nvMbr 1972) ivwc mYN ‘kRFqIkfrI kivqf dy Xuwg df jrnYl kvI qy gfiek ikhf’ sI, aqy pfsL ny AudfsI nUM ‘kwdfvr aqy aphuMc’ kvI ikhf sI. AudfsI dI kivqf ’c srodI gux pfsL dI kivqf nflLoN vwD hn. dilq vrg df anuBv aqy icqrx vI AudfsI dI kivqf ivwc bfkI sfry kRFqIkfrI kvIaF nflLoN vDyry hY. pr jmfqI sMGrsL aqy smkflI rfjnIqk siQqIaF nUM ijMnI zMUGfeI nflL pfsL ny pkiVaf hY, Auh isrPL Ausdy ihwsy hI afieaf hY. pfsL-ivroDIaF nUM lgdf hY ik pfsL nUM ‘jwt’ hox krky, jF ‘sLhId’ ho jfx krky, byloVf AuWicafieaf jf irhf hY. pr ‘lyKk’, ‘jwt’, aqy ‘sLhId’ qF hor vI hn, Auh sfry pfsL ijMny mkbUl ikAuN nhIN ho gey? myrf idRV ivcfr ieh hY ik pfsL inrol afpxI ivlwKx kfiv-pRiqBf krky amr rhygf, AudfsI afpxI kivqf aqy gfiekI dy sumyl krky ijAUNdf rhygf, aqy dovF df ivlwKx Xogdfn pRqwK hY.

dIpk- rfhI iewk ieMtrivAU ivwc kihMdf hY ik pfsL iswK ivrsy qoN aiBwj sI, pr ‘bydfvf’ aqy ‘aMiqkf’ vrgIaF kivqfvF qoN qF ajyhf nhIN lgdf.

DMjl- koeI vI sMjIdf pMjfbI lyKk, iswK ivrsy qoN aiBwj nhIN rih skdf. XfrF dosqF dIaF mihPLlF ivwc ikqy ikqy hlky-Pulky jF sLrfrqI aMdfjL ivwc ivcrn vflLf pfsL, kfiv-rcnf dy sMdrB ivwc inhfieq sMjIdf sI. Aus nyy iswK ivrsy df vI sMjIdgI nflL zUMGf aiDan kIqf sI. Aus dIaF kivqfvF ‘bydfvf’, ‘sLrDFjlI’, ‘ÉUbsUrq pYz kMDF jylH dIaF’, ‘siBafcfr dI Koj’, ‘lhU ikRaf’, ‘aMiqkf’, ‘kwKF dIey kuwlIey’, ‘jogf isMG dI sÍY pVcol’, ‘kfmryz nflL gwlbfq’, ‘13 apRYl’ ivwc iswK ivrsy df gUhVf icqRx hY. aYNtI-47 PrMt dI akflk lVI (nMbr 4, 26 akqUbr 1986) dy muwK pMny ’qy, pfsL dI hwQ-ilKq ivwc, iswK gurU sfihbfnF aqy hor iswK mrjIviVaF dIaF kurbfnIaF df BrpUr vrnx hY. so jLfhr hY ik pfsL iswK ivrsy qoN aiBwj nhIN sI, pr ijs bybfk aMdfË ivwc pfÈ ny ‘purbF dy nÈy ivwc bydfvf ilKx vfiÜaF’ nUM, aqy ‘aKOqI Drm-gurUaF’ nUM byprd kIqf sI, Auh iswKI dy ajoky TykydfrF qoN brdfÈq nhIN ho irhf.

dIpk- ikqfb dy pMnf 121 ’qy gurbIr isMG kihMdf hY ik ieh PLYslf (pfsL nUM mfrn df) “iksy KfilsqfnI iDr dI vI lIzrisLp df nhIN sI! ieh kql qF Qwly vfly pwDr dy KfilsqfnIaF vwloN sI.” kI ieh swc hY?

DMjl- nhIN, ieh korf JUT hY. DIdo aqy sfQIaF nUM 19 aprYl 1984 nUM ilKy KLq ivwc pfsL ilKdf hY: “iBMzrF vflLy dI nvIN lgOV ny nkodr ielfky dy cfr bMdy soD dyx dI Xojnf bxfeI hY. ivwc myrf nfEN ivsLysL qOr ’qy sI[[[ [[[ cfr pMj idn pihlF hoeI iswK PYzrysLn dI mIitMg ivwc do lIzr hYzkuafrtr qoN afey sn qy AunHF ny ielfky ’coN cfr bMdy cuxn leI lokl XUint nUM ikhf. myrf nF AunHF ny Kud hI afpxy vwloN pysL kIqf sI.” pfsL df ieh KLq pfÈ tRst dI pusqk ‘pfsL dIaf icwTIaF’ ivwc sPLf 147-150 ’qy pRkfisLq kr cuwky hF. iewk hor korf JUT suxo: rfhI dy isrjy ‘gurbIr’ (pMnf 120) anusfr “styt pfsL dI sLhIdI mnfAux leI sihXog idMdI hY” , jdik pfsL tRst ny awj qwk iksy styt qoN iewk pYsf nhIN ilaf, sfrf KLrcf lokF dy blbUqy kIqf hY.

dIpk- quhfzy dwsx anusfr quhfzy AuWpr puls df Cfpf 1970 julfeI dy aMq jF agsq dy ÈurU ivwc ipaf aqy akqUbr 1972 ivwc qusIN kYnzf af gey. pr rfhI dI ikqfb ivwcoN qF ieAuN lgdY ijvyN puls df Cfpf pYx sfr hI qusIN kYnzf Bwj inklLy hovoN! myrf 1971-75 qwk ieMjnIairMg kflj df klfs-PYlo hrimMdr puryvfl jo awj-kwlH trFto rihMdf hY, vI dws irhf sI ik Auh quhfnUM pfsL smyq 1972 dy aMq ijhy ’c nkodr imilaf sI[[[hwd ho geI,

DMjl- rfhI dI bd-idafnqdfrI dI ieh iewk hor AuWGVvIN imsfl hY. aslIaq ieh hY ik puls Cfpy qoN bfad mYN do sfl qoN vwD smF pMjfb ’c irhf. anykF kfrkuMn imlLdy iglLdy rhy[[[afKLrI vfr goibMdr isMG vI mYnUM 1972 dy ÈurU ivwc hI imilLaf sI, jdoN hrBjn hlvfrvI, juigMdr isMG, aqy goibMdr isMG, iqMny pMjfb dI nkslbfVI lihr dy kfrkuMnF vjoN, kflj dy hostl ivwc afey sn; aqy myrI pusqk ‘sUrjF dy hmsPLr’ aqy bUtf rfm dI pusqk ‘gihrI awK’ dy KriVaF nUM prvfngI dy ky gey sn. goibMdr isMG dI ingHf ivclf 1972 qwk df ‘kRFqIkfrI kvI DMjl’, rfhI ny bdlf lYx dI bdnIaqI nflL afpxI ikqfb ivwc kI df kI bxf Diraf hY! myrI pihlI pusqk ‘sUrjF dy hmsPLr’ vI meI 1972 ivwc myry Bfrq rihMidaF hI CpI sI. pfsL, mihMdr isMG sMDU (sMpfdk ‘jQybMdI’), mYN aqy hrimMdr puryvfl sqMbr 1972 ivwc nkodr imlLy sI. AuhnIN idnIN mYN pfsL dy prcy ‘isafV’ aqy mihMdr isMG sMDU dy prcy ‘jQybMdI’ qoN ielfvf ‘afrsI’, ‘srdl’, ‘ikMqU’, ‘jIvn sFJF’, ‘ividafrQI sMGrsL’, ‘sMklp’ afid pricaF ’c lgfqfr Cpdf huMdf sI. jfnx vflLy jfxdy hn ik AudoN qoN hux qwk, mYN afpxI cfly inrMqr eysy rfh ’qy idRVqf nflL quiraf af irhf hF.

dIpk- sMq rfm AudfsI dy prvfr nUM, jF rfhI dI skwqrI hyT cwl rhy AudfsI tRst nUM, kI hfly qwk, AudfsI dy kfivk ivcfrF nUM qroVn-mroVn dIaF, jF kRFqIkfrI AudfsI nUM iPLrkU jnUMn dy hwk ’c BugqfAux dIaF, rfhI dIaF ‘axQwk’ koisLsLF df pqf hI nhIN lwigaf?

DMjl- hOlLI hOlLI sB nUM pqf lwg igaf hY. PrvrI 2009 ivwc jdoN mYN AudfsI dI pqnI nsIb kOr AudfsI, AudfsI dI bImfr bytI ipRqpfl, aqy AudfsI dy byty nUM imlx brnfly igaf, qF nsIb kOr df ibafn sI ik “rfhI lokF kolL kihMdf iPrdf hY ik myrI bytI iekbfl qoN bgLYr AudfsI-prvfr df koeI mYNbr kRFqIkfrI nhIN. mYN qF do pMcfieqF dy sfhmxy rfhI nUM iswDf kih idwqf sI beI jdoN iqMn iqMn ijLilHaF dI puls sMq rfm AudfsI nUM lBdI lBdI sfzy sfry prvfr ’qy zFgF vrHfAuNdI huMdI sI AudoN Ausdf sfhmxf kOx krdf sI?” kihx nUM qF hor vI bhuq kuJ hY, pr mYN rfhI vflLI pwDr qwk nhIN izwgxf cfhuMdf. rhI gwl rfhI dI skwqrI dI[[[ rfhI dIaF AudfsI nUM qoVn-mroVn vflLIaF klfbfjLIaF krky AudfsI tRst ny, 2009 dy ÈurU ivwc, rfhI nMU tRst dy skwqr dI pojLIsLn qoN AuqfrU krky pRiswD khfxIkfr ajmyr iswDU nUM tRst df nvF jnrl skwqr Qfp idwqf hY.

dIpk- quhfzI aqy pfsL dy ipqf sohx isMG sMDU dI sMpfidq pusqk ‘pfsL qF sUrj sI’ dI pRkfsLnF qoN icVH ky, rfhI ny ‘sLbd’ (jlMDr) ivwc CpI iewk ilKq ivwc pfsL nUM ‘miraf hoieaf sUrj’ grdfinaf hY?

DMjl- sfzI pusqk ‘pfsL qF sUrj sI’ ivwc pRkfisLq Cy dysF ivwc vsdy lg-pg sO kvIaF dIaF pfsL bfry lg-pg zyZ sO kivqfvF nUM rfhI ny afpxI ieMtrivAU ivwc ‘pfsL bfry ilKIaF jjLbfqI aqy kwc-GrV rcnfvF’ dI pusqk ikhf hY. jy ipafrf isMG sihrfeI, sMqoK isMG DIr, hrBjn isMG huMdl, surjIq pfqr, mohnjIq, svrfjbIr, inrupmf dwq, amrjIq kONky, inrMjx isMG nUr, mjLhr iqrmjLI, suKivMdr kMboj, rivMdr sihrfa, sLsLI smuMdrf, gurcrn rfmpurI, iekbfl rfmUvflIaf, krnYl isMG pfrs, ajmyr rozy, drsLn igwl, sfDU, ivsLfl, aqy zf[ hirBjn isMG vrgy kvIaF dIaF rcnfvF ‘jjLbfqI aqy kwc-GrV’ hn qF ‘gLYr-jjLbfqI aqy pkrOV’ rcnfvF dy lyKk asIN ikMny ku, aqy ikwQoN lwBFgy? ‘pfsL qF sUrj sI’ dI pRkfsLnF bfry ies icVH dI aslIaq ieh hY ik pfsL-ivroDI iDrF qoN pfsL dI mkbUlIaq nf qF pfsL dy ijAUNdy-jIa brdfsLq ho rhI sI, nf hI hux ho rhI hY. ‘sLbd’ dy julfeI-sqMbr 2009 aMk ivwc CpI ihMdI-pMjfbI dy pRiswD icMqk zfktr cmn lfl (jvfhr lfl nihrU XUnIvristI, idwlI) dI jvfbI itwpxI anusfr pfsL lfiebRyrI krnflL dy sbMD ivwc rfhI ny jo kuJ vI ‘sLbd’ ivwc iliKaf hY, Auh srfsr ‘JUT’, ‘icwkV AuCflI’, ‘hoCI ieljLfmbfjLI’, aqy ‘sOVI eIrKf’ hY. hr cOQy idn ivcfr bdlx vflLy iksy vI cuPyr-gVHIey inMdk dIaF aijhIaF kUV-khfxIaF pfsL vrgy sUrj ’qy Quwkx vFg hn. pfsL XfdgfrI lfiebRyrI krnflL dy hoNd ivwc aOx dy pUry vyrvy jsbIr smr dy qIjy lyK (‘srokfr’ 37) ivwc vI drj hn.

dIpk- rfhI dI ikqfb 2008 dI CpI hoeI hY, qusIN ies bfry hfly qwk kuJ nhIN iliKaf?

DMjl- 20 julfeI 2008 nUM pfsL tRst dI pMjfb kmytI dI iewk mIitMg ivwc zfktr BImieMdr isMG, khfxIkfr aqrjIq, nftkkfr jgIr josx, kfmryz amolk, kfmryz gurmIq, kfmryz kMvljIq KMnf aqy mYN sLfml sF. sFJf PYslf sI ik tRst dy sqMbr 2008 jlMDr smfgm ivwc pMjfb kmytI dy mYNbr zfktr primMdr isMG (gurU nfnk dyv XUnIvristI) ‘kRFqIkfrI kivqf df BivwK: cuxOqIaF aqy sMBfvnfvF’ isrlyK hyT pfsL-XfdgfrI lYkcr smyN sfzf stYNz spsLt kr dyx aqy aqrjIq ‘srokfr’ ivwc lyK ilK dyx; ies qoN vwD rfhI dI hAuNmYN nUM pwTy nf pfey jfx. rfhI dy kuPLr nflL sMbMiDq ieh dovyN lyK, aqy keI hor lyK asIN meI 2009 ivwc tRst dI pRkfsLnF ‘sfihq df sfgr: pfsL’ (sMpfdk: pfsL dy ipqf sohx isMG sMDU) ivwc vI Cfp cuwky hF. ‘pMjfbI itRibAUn’ dy sInIar Aup-sMpfdk jsbIr smr dI sMpfdnF hyT eys ivsLy ’qy iewk pUry dI pUrI pusqk ‘pfsL, pMjfb aqy KLfilsqfn’, 2010 ivwc pRkfisLq ho rhI hY. myry iKLafl ivwc ieh kfPLI sI. pr hux quhfzy vfr vfr kIqy svflF ny myrI cuwp qoV idwqI hY.

dIpk- sfrIaF gwlF bfqF dy incoV vjoN kI kihxf cfhoNgy?

DMjl- hkUmqI jF iPLrkU dihsLqgrd cfhy rfhI dI ikqfb df Bys vtf ky sfhmxy afAux, cfhy iksy hor Bys ivwc, iehnF dy kfqlfnF mnsUibaF qoN inrMqr KLbrdfr rihx dI loV hY. rfhI dI ilKq df asl mksd pfsL dy kfqlF dI lihr nUM glorIPfeI krnf, nkslbfVI lihr aqy pfsL nUM CuitafAuxf, aqy mYnUM GtIaf qoN GtIaf iswD kr ky rfiesr smfgm ivwc hoeI nmosLI df bdlf lYxf sI. rfhI ny afpxy cuPyr-gVHIey ikrdfr anusfr pfsL dI ÈÉsIaq nUM, AudfsI dI ÈÉsIaq vFg CFg ky KLfilsqfn-pwKI iswty vI kwZxy sn, aqy ‘swcy’ vI bxy rihxf sI. swcy bxy rihx dI eysy lflsf krky hI ijhVIaF gwlF rfhI Éud kihxf cfhuMdf sI, Auh gwlF Ausny iewk nklI pfqr ‘gurbIr’ dy mUMhoN kZvfeIaF hn. sMq rfm AudfsI ny sI[ mfrkMzf nflL iewk ieMtrivAU ivwc ikhf sI ik ivroDI iDr quhfzy ’qy “lok-ilKfrI hox df qF kI, lok-DRohI hox df dUsLx vI lf skdI hY.” rfhI ny myry bfry ies qrHF df Kfsf gMd-mMd ‘gurbIr’ dy mUMh ivwc pfieaf hY. dUjy pfsy ajmyr isMG ny bdly hoey stYNz muqfbk afpxI KLfilsqfnI soc df prcfr krnf sI. ieAuN rfhI aqy ajmyr isMG, dohF ny iewk-dUjy dy moZy ’qy rwK ky clfeI hY. pfsL dI mkbUlIaq nUM mohrf bxf ky cwlI geI dohF dI ieh cfl burI qrHF nMgI ho cuwkI hY. bhuq qswlI vflLI gwl hY ik Auprokq sfry lyKkF ny ies cfl df gMBIr noits ilaf hY. ieh sfry lyKk rfhI dI ilKq ivwcly eyny JUTF df prdf cfk kr cuwky hn, ik rfhI dI ilKq dy ‘JUT df pulMdf’ hox bfry iksy sLwk dI koeI guMjfiesL nhIN rih jFdI. eynIaF mnGVq gwlF hornF dy mUMhF ’c pfAux dy mfhr rfhI ny jLfqI ikVF kwZx leI ‘klfqmk lfeIsYNs’ dy prdy hyT anykF nfmvr sLKLsIaqF qoN ielfvf, pfsL aqy myry bfry jo jLihr AuWgilaf hY, smkfl qF eys kuPLr dI aslIaq qoN BlIBFq vfkPL ho hI cuwikaf hY; pr afAux vflLIaF pIVHIaF ikqy Ausdy iksy ilKqI JUT nUM swc nf smJ bYTx: ies krky quhfzy kihx ’qy cMd sLbd quhfnUM ilKf idwqy hn qF ik snd rhy.